Tax changes / proposals - discussion

Tax changes / proposals - discussion


Never claimed it was. Wales is the source.

Are your fingers broke ?

I already know what he said. Why should I jump through hoops for readily-available common knowledge ?

This is not a controversial issue. Anyone who is informed already knows it. If you want to be informed, look it up. If you don’t want to be informed, don’t look it up.


You clearly don’t understand what a source is, or why it matters in a discussion. This is a pointless tangent. I’ll go back to ignoring you.


Its not readily available common knowledge

Its not “jumping through hoops” for you prove your claims. Your refusal to do so undercuts your credibility… repeatedly.


I’m going to politely suggest as a mod here that y’all take this debate to a private channel.


I actually spent a not-insignificant amount of time looking for any quotes from Wales about Wikipedia and opinion. This was the best I could find:

“But Wikipedia is much more than an encyclopedia. It is a community of people who work to set aside opinion and bias in favour of neutrality and fact, all in the service of knowledge.”

Source: (Author of this was Jimmy Wales)


While I agree that it isn’t useful for republicans to tell people who aren’t seeing much in terms of saving that they are still getting something (I don’t specifically remember any saying people should be “grateful”), I feel like it is equally unfair for democrats to claim that the middle class in general is getting peanuts when they are the party that claims $10 a month for birth control is a burdensome expense that no woman should be forced to pay.

Didn’t we come to the conclusion that a large portion of people whose taxes are increasing are high earners that are losing the SALT deduction? Those folks are not middle class. Aside from middle class people with several kids (dependents) living with them, but over 17 (too old for the child tax credit), what other middle class folks are seeing tax increases?


Aside from the fact that you dismiss our requests for a source, it’s important to point out that even taken completely out of context, none of those quotes can be boiled down to what you claimed Wales said (that Wikipedia is OPINION). Those quotes simply show that Wales doesn’t dispute that there is some false information on Wikipedia. I don’t think anyone arguing with you right now would disagree with that claim.


While I totally understand not wanting to bother posting in this thread, what specifically is wrong with the discussion that it needs to be shut down by a moderator?


Isn’t the whole point of this thread supposed to be about adjusting strategies to use the new system optimally?


That ship set sail months ago.


Maybe we should have a “tax policy discussion” thread for arguing about stuff related to taxes, and use this one for tax changes, proposals, planning and potentially useful things?


Of course it is. I watched it.

Because I watched the interviews over time, I don’t remember which programs they were, so you expect me to exhaustively search for all the TV and radio interviews Wales has done and then comb through all those transcripts, then post the quotes here with the accompanying links ? To what end ?

This is an OFF-TOPIC ISSUE, and certainly not my raison d’être. Because what he admitted to was so shocking, I do remember what Wales said. If you don’t trust my recollections, that’s fine. That’s your prerogative. I don’t care. That’s my prerogative.


Is there a group of middle class people with a specific circumstance that Trump’s tax cut forgot about that will cause their taxes to go up? Or is it just a few random households that don’t have anything in common, but the perfect storm came together to cause their taxes to go up? And do those random households actually total into the millions? These are legit questions. You’re the one making the claims. You should be able to answer them.


What’s middle class in NYC, LA, SF (since we’re talking about state tax deduction I’m choosing high tax jurisdictions)?


Depending on what chart you visit, the middle quintile for the USA is households making between $43,500-$72,000. The overall median household income is $53,000.

The median household income in the NYC metro is $66,300, LA is $60,300, SF is $77,900. It’s fair to say that the middle class in NYC is $56k-$85k, LA $50k-$79k, and SF $68k-$97k.


Based on your definition of middle class, I’d say your conclusion is probably pretty fair. As you pointed out, there could be a perfect storm scenario for those households, but generally households in those income ranges in those localities probably won’t see much of an increase, if any.

I wouldn’t consider a household making 60k in LA (30k per person) to be middle class, but again, that’s why I asked for your definition. I don’t think the ending analysis of what middle class is is based on averages. In other words, I think it’s theoretically possible that the top 1% of earners is upper class, the next 1% is middle class, and the remaining 98% is lower class.


I don’t mind having a separate thread dedicated to actually useful things, but unfortunately, I think this one has essentially become the discussion thread. I’m pretty sure “discussion” posts vastly outnumber “useful tax strategy” posts.


Yeah and putting the word “discussion” in the thread title probably didn’t help keep it from becoming the discussion thread…

(even if this isn’t the discussion you wanted…)


Already previously addressed, contemporaneously, when the tax bill exited the congress, UPTHREAD.

Unfortunately, you do not pay attention, and do not read and/or comprehend what others post.

You’re like ‘Whack-A-Mole’.


The White House and the Congressional GOP had promised that just the mere passage of their tax bill, which overwhelmingly favored the top 1% of income earners, would spur business investment and increase economic growth.

~ GDP slowed in the first quarter of 2018 to 2.3%, down from 2.9% in the last quarter of 2017.

~ In the first quarter of 2018, the growth of non-residential fixed investment decelerated relative to the final quarter of 2017, falling from 6.8% to 6.1%.

~ Business investment also slowed measured as the change from the same quarter in the previous year, falling from 5.4% in the first quarter of 2017 to 4.6% in the first quarter of 2018.