When will you allow yourself to be vaccinated?

So which science are we suppose to be listening to?

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Exactly. Everybody has a study. The outcomes are in conflict. And nobody knows what is going on.

Even the mainstream media has picked up on this, at least a little, which is surprising. They had one guy on TV who said out loud:

Iā€™m a scientist and I have no idea whatā€™s going on!

Shots, boosters, mix and match . . . itā€™s all a mix mox. Nobody is in charge and offering the public clear, consistent, counsel.

What a mess!!

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Worth clarifying I think that the above ā€œ% protectionā€ numbers are the reduced odds of getting symptoms from covid compared to an unvaccinated person, or a more recently vaccinated person. The numbers are lower in part due to Delta being different than the original vaccine target and in part from the time passing and many people having fewer antibodies if they havenā€™t been re-exposed since then in their daily life.

The numbers for protection against hospitalization and dying are lower but still pretty high, 80-90% better compared to no vaccine, for both the PFE and MRNA ones.

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Yes what to do? My problem!

Received Covid Vaccination 2/28/21 then 3/28/21.
High dose Flu vaccination 10/12/21.

Iā€™m dosed up now. How about booster shot, when or if? :slight_smile:

Iā€™m seeing the passing of Secretary Powell as a spear into the heart of Bidenā€™s efforts to promote vaccination. Powell, an extremely high profile individual, was vaccinated but died regardless. People disinclined to be vaccinated will see this as confirmation of their choice . . . which it most assuredly is NOT!

This is clearly not Bidenā€™s fault. But it certainly is going to make his prospects for success against COVID-19 even poorer.

If so, itā€™s their own fault. This was a death with Covid not a death from covid. He had cancer. The left loves to conflate those. The left also loves him because he turned on the people who helped him throughout his career and supported the last three Democrats in presidential elections

Yes, this always bothered me also. I had so much respect for his military service. Politics, not so much!

When Obama came to the forefront, Colin couldnā€™t help himself. Changes abounded. I could go along with First Black President. But he turned around completely as far as being interested in anyone other than a Democrat.

Reporting from CNN indicates Secretary Powell was suffering from cancer too, so clearly in the very high risk group.

They did cite covid complications in his cause of death. Not sure if thatā€™s for real or what, hard to tell from afar.

It is worth noting that many cancer treatments tend to suppress your immune system, so itā€™s possible that because of that, his vaccine didnā€™t work or didnā€™t work as well as it might have in a more typical person of his age.

causation is a slippery philosophical concept. he may have had Covid antibodies in his system but the ultimate cause of death was his cancer. Plus, if I recall correctly, the hospital gets more money for treating Covid cases so they have a motive for implicating covid as much as possible.

For the record:

When I first learned of Secretary Powellā€™s passing, very early this morning, the reporting made no mention of cancer. That came later, which is something I view as unfortunate. First impressions for some individuals can be lasting. And a reasonable first impression was that he passed owing to COVID-19 even though he had fully been vaccinated. Obviously we now have the larger picture. Itā€™s a shame the cancer announcement was not made earlier.

FDA Advisory panel recommended PFE for kids age 5-11. Final FDA ruling should be shortly.

https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/us-fda-advisers-weigh-pfizerbiontech-covid-19-vaccine-children-2021-10-26/

https://www.fda.gov/advisory-committees/advisory-committee-calendar/vaccines-and-related-biological-products-advisory-committee-october-26-2021-meeting-announcement

No myocarditis cases occurred during pediatric clinical trials, Pfizer said. But the company also noted its trial size, while doubled at FDAā€™s request, wasnā€™t large enough to detect such a rare event. The companyā€™s study enrolled more than 4,600 children, of whom roughly 3,100 received the vaccine; the remainder received a placebo.

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JNJ trials are still happening for kids so it could be a while b/f avail for my 6 y.o . Apparently mRNA tech has been around a long time too. The tangled history of mRNA vaccines

I hate to say it, but I will probably consider this for my sonā€¦ IF it means he doesnā€™t have to wear a mask in school.

But I would wait 2 months or so, to let a few 100k other kids be the guinea pigs first.

If masks stay mandatory after vaccination - I donā€™t see any point in him getting it.

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Just curiousā€¦ not flaming or anything

What will you know in 2 months?

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If there are side effects that outweigh the microscopic amount of protection the vaccine offers to kids that young. And if they are going to let kids go to school without masks.

Long covid effects stacking up, and see what he volunteered his kid for?

Our favorite Hawaiian physician, Buzz Hollander, weighs in on vaccine mandates for children. as usual he does a thorough, well researched presentation. He sees big problems with them.

https://www.realclearscience.com/articles/2021/10/26/the_trouble_with_school_mandates_for_the_pfizer_vaccine_800698.html

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Thanks. From the article on whether it makes sense to vaccinate kids, esp boys at risk of heart related vaccine issues, this stood out

this week Pfizer rather surprisingly admits this possibility in their documents for FDA review! In times of low community prevalence, they state: ā€œthe model predicts more excess hospitalizations due to vaccine-related myocarditis/pericarditis compared to prevented hospitalizations due to COVID-19 in males and in both sexes combined.ā€

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Too bad weā€™re not in low community prevalenceā€¦